The LoCo Experience

EXPERIENCE 243 | Marshall Spring - Founder of Combat Recovery Foundation

• Ava Munos • Season 5 • Episode 243

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In today’s episode, I sat down with Marshall Spring, Founder of Combat Recovery Foundation.  

Marshall is a combat-disabled Marine Corps Explosives Detection Dog Handler, former police officer, private-security entrepreneur, and suicide prevention expert. 

This is an intense conversation with an insightful guy, and I know you’ll enjoy my conversation with Marshall Spring.  


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Music By: A Brother's Fountain

Speaker 6:

In today's episode, I sat down with Marshall Spring, founder of Combat Recovery Foundation. Marshall is a combat disabled Marine Corps explosive detection dog handler, former police officer, private security entrepreneur, and suicide prevention expert. This is an intense conversation with an insightful guy, and I know you'll enjoy my conversation with Marshall Spring.

Speaker 7:

Let's have some fun. Welcome to the Loco Experience Podcast. On this show, you'll get to know business and community leaders from all around Northern Colorado and beyond. Our guests share their stories, business stories, life stories, stories of triumph and of tragedy. And through it all, you'll be inspired and entertained. These conversations are real and raw, and no topics are off limits. So pop in a breath mint and get ready to meet our latest guest.

Speaker 2:

Alright, welcome back to the Loco Experience Podcast. My guest today is Marshall Spring and he is the founder and CEO of Combat Recovery Foundation, which is a organization focused on suicide prevention, especially in the combat, um, the veteran space post military space.

Speaker:

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you so much, uh, for having me on Kurt. Yeah. Uh, really love, uh, the Loco Think tank and, uh, you know, the work that you guys are doing up here. So I'm really honored to be a part of this podcast.

Speaker 2:

Well, thank you. I, uh, try to bring interesting community stories to light once in a while and, and yours certainly is that, um, maybe just set the stage for listeners. Um. Tell us about Combat Recovery Foundation, what you're up to, what kind of, I know you do a lot of like retreats and events, but to with who, where all across Colorado. Yeah. Tell me about it.

Speaker:

Yeah. Yeah. I guess we'll get started with like the, uh, a hundred thousand foot view and just kind of go from there. So, combat Recovery Foundation is focused on evidence-based effective suicide prevention for veterans. Um, I founded this organization, uh, September 11th, 2023. Okay. And we officially opened for business August 18th of 24. Oh, wow. And so as of right now, while to get the

Speaker 2:

nonprofit status and all that kind of stuff, yeah. You

Speaker:

have to get the status and, and you have to get your funding in place and your programming ready to go. And so there's a lot that needs to go into getting it set up. So, um, we've, we've officially been open for business just over a year Right. As we stand right now. Right, right. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Okay. So we don't really know exactly what we're doing. We're doing a lot of stuff.

Speaker:

We're doing a lot of stuff. We're doing a lot of stuff. So, um,

Speaker 2:

but we'll probably do a lot different stuff three years from now or five because

Speaker:

our, our, um, still young, our approach to suicide prevention is, um, is we basically have three buckets, if you will. Okay. And, uh, the first is one-on-one peer coaching. Hmm. And, um, so I, I, the, the peer part because, um, lived experience is, is more effective than education educational experience. Sure. And so, um, putting someone across the table from someone in crisis who, who has lived through that and survived that gives them an opportunity to see what the path through that storm looks like. Mm-hmm. And, and what thriving on the other side of it can, can be for a person. And so, so that, that's why the peer part. And then are those coaches volunteers? Are they trained? So we have an in-house training certification for peer coaching, and then the coaching piece is about, um, helping individuals to, um, to thrive rather than just survive. Sure. So it's, it's about way more than suicide prevention. So you're not

Speaker 2:

just pulling'em out of the. The depths of despair, you're, you're pointing'em towards something.

Speaker:

Yeah. So, so you know, the crisis piece of it, that's, that's a component, but it's, it's about how do we ensure that this person doesn't continually end up in crisis, and how do we make sure, make sure this person is thriving, because then we know that, that, that they will do that for the people around them.

Speaker 3:

Yeah.

Speaker:

That's, that's the thing about, um, veterans and why we focus on veterans is because, um, at some point in their life, I know that person signed their line, signed on a line to, to put their life on the line in defense of a stranger.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Right. And, and for me, there's really no more compassionate thing that a person can do than that.

Speaker 2:

Well, and like their rate of suicide is like five, I remember a 22 a day or something was a number. Is that, is that still true or, or worse or better, but I know the rate of suicide is much higher among veterans than it is among. Average population.

Speaker:

Yeah. So, um, talking about the rates of suicide, um, the number 22 gets thrown around a lot. I

Speaker 2:

remember it was years ago now, so I'm too, it's wrong,

Speaker:

right? Yeah. Well, it always has been.

Speaker 2:

Okay.

Speaker:

Yeah. And we'll talk about that. And so, so the VA will tell you, uh, 17 and a half, uh, a day. Okay. And also inaccurate. Um, so the problem is that, um, when, when a, when a, when a death is investigated, it's, it's the coroner that, that determines how that person died. Yeah. And so if there is not a clear cut, um, suicide note, I think a

Speaker 2:

note. Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah. Then it probably won't get ruled to suicide. Hmm. Um, also there can be a ton of pressure put on the coroner's office. Yep. Not to rule a famous suicide. Must've his gun. Exactly. And, and coroners are elected. Just like sheriffs.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker:

So they care. So whatever

Speaker 2:

the numbers are, it's vastly they care about their constituency under the real actual

Speaker:

number. Another issue is there's no database that you can plug a person's name into to identify whether they were a veteran. For real, for real, for real.

Speaker 4:

Oh wow.

Speaker:

So if there's no clear cut indicators, indicators, that person served in the military, again, not gonna get ruled a, a veteran suicide. Interesting. And then suicide doesn't account for deaths of despair. So un un unchecked, you know, episodes of, of extreme depression and unhappiness and, and, you know, loss of purpose and loss of belonging goes unchecked for so long. It can result in a death or even a

Speaker 2:

DUI car crash.

Speaker:

Exactly. That would be a perfect example of that. Yeah. A perfect example of that. That's not a suicide, but it's absolutely a symptom of, of, of the same type of contributing factors that end up in suicide. So the bottom line is, number one, we do not know how many veterans kill themselves. Yeah. That's, that's the truth. Uh. We, uh, the, the math and, and, and, and what we do know indicates that, um, veterans are four to six times more likely to kill themselves than the average person. Fair.

Speaker 2:

So that was, there was one that was, it kind of derailed you, but that was one pillar you started talking about was the one-on-one peer coaching. Yeah. On the three, I think, right? Yeah. So

Speaker:

we have the one-on-one peer coaching. Okay. And then we've got education and advocacy, and that's what I'm doing right here today. Right. Just getting the word out about it. Right. Fair.

Speaker 2:

Because we, you just talk to a rotary club or this or that kind of thing. Right. Well, and you

Speaker:

just set me up for it. Right. You asked about the rate of suicide. I got to talk about it Now. That's information that your listeners have that they didn't before. No. You can write off that bottom or, or maybe they did, but you know that, that that's what, that's this is a part of what we do here. Yeah. Okay. And then, and then the last piece, and this is really where the rubber hits the road for our organization is, um, building resilient communities. And we, we get involved in community, in, in serving the community. And so what that looks like is. We, um, work in the back country and we get involved in wildfire mitigation and recovery work. Uh, we help build trails. We get involved in habitat restoration and we protect the watershed. We also do, uh, counter poaching activities. Wow. Because these are problems that we have here locally in Larimer County, wildfire poaching watershed. Like these are really, really what are cool

Speaker 2:

poaching

Speaker:

elk. Oh, we have the, we have the largest elk probably just for their

Speaker 2:

horns even

Speaker:

we have the largest elk or meat too. Yeah. Yeah. So. We have the largest elk herd in the world here. And, um, and, and, okay. And, and so because that falls within our borders, we are stewards of, of that herd. Yeah. And so in ensuring that they're not being poached is a way that I can, I can help service the community, help veterans to experience purpose and belonging by having a mission and a team to execute a mission with.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. There's a, there's an old book that I've read and discussed recently and becoming more relevant, I think, but Join or Die. Are you familiar with that? No, I haven't heard of it. It's kind of the notion that in the decline of organizations like jcs and Lions Clubs and churches in general and stuff. Oh. Like there's just this real lack of community and lack of connection and what you're talking about here and, and, and, and the real outcome of that is. People maybe, maybe don't die like suicide themselves, but they, they die before like a grape turns into a raisin, you know, they shrivel up kind of. Yeah. And you're expanding those. Those, uh, opportunities for real purposeful engagement.

Speaker:

Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. With community, really clever title, uh, for the book, by the way, now that I understand the, uh, context. So yeah, the, uh, the, it's, it's, it's the, the, we're losing those third spaces Yeah. Where, um, we used to spend so much time and, and those are, those are going away and, and many have gone away. And so that's exactly what we're doing is, is we're creating a space for people to come together, be together, and, and get them out of the isolation.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Yeah. And especially in the church of the outdoors.

Speaker:

Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, being outdoors, just augments the, uh, impact and value of it all.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Cool. What, uh, what inspired you to create this organization? And like, were there other organizations doing what you do or was it because there wasn't that you started this or talk to me about that.

Speaker:

Yeah, so. Um, in 2019, uh, my business partner, who was a Marine, uh, very unexpectedly shot himself. Okay. And, um, not to interrupt, but what

Speaker 2:

kind of business?

Speaker:

Oh, a security company. Okay. So I, I, I, I worked in, um, the security industry for, um, about 20 years.

Speaker 2:

Okay.

Speaker:

Um, after the Marine Corps.

Speaker 2:

Oh, you're that old? I am. I thought you were like 37 or something. I'm 42. Okay. Well, just about Anyway. Yeah.

Speaker:

So I, well, I've, for reference, I've been outta the Marine Corps for 20 years. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Fair.

Speaker:

So, um, so. We, uh, so, uh, yeah. Um, so my business partner, you know, uh, took his life and I, I got really frustrated with, uh, the VA and, um, the, the extraordinary rate of veteran suicide. And, um, so just as a point of reference, so, so the VA is, can,

Speaker 2:

can you set the stage like Yeah,

Speaker:

absolutely. So the VA is a$470 billion, uh, healthcare organization and they are sitting on top of the highest rate of suicide in the history of our species. Yeah. Um, that, that, so. It's, they're evidentially ineffective. Yeah. Um, and, uh, and the military, I'm sure they

Speaker 2:

just try to put a pill on it and whatever your problem is, in most cases,

Speaker:

the military doesn't do a very good job of, of, of transitioning people. And, and there's a, the military and, and the VA both come under a lot of criticism for that. And, and so, you know, in, in, in working through how, how can we improve this, it kind of occurred to me that really historically it has never been the responsibility of militaries to rehabilitate war fighters. Yeah. We as communities who are sending our young people out into the world to fight wars for us, it's on us. Yeah. To bring them back home and to invest in them because they're worth it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. I mean, I, and there is to some level, at least an investment in them, a. From the government, you know, they've skill upskilled'em, they've, they've given'em in some cases of retirement or different opportunities or whatever. So they've, you know, uh, and, and, and from a federal program level, it would be hard to, for a, for a federal program to reintegrate people into a local community. Right. It almost has to be done Exactly. A local level.'cause they don't know what they're doing. They're, yeah. Um, so you saw that absence of like a, a way to feel and be integrated. Is there a timeline? Like are you reaching out to, to recently release veterans or is it like, like, it sounds like your business partner was probably out for quite a while as well.

Speaker:

Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, we will work with any veterans. Um, and we have veterans who just, just transitioned. We have, we have actually active duty members who haven't transitioned yet. And then, um, and you know, I think our oldest participant is in his nineties.

Speaker 2:

Wow. And it's about having community. Yeah, absolutely. So you were set the stage, your your business partner? Yeah. Killed himself.

Speaker:

So that, and then, um, I, I, I went and worked for a nonprofit and Okay. I stood up their, their veteran suicide prevention, um, wing or Okay. Or

Speaker 2:

effort. Is that something you can talk about? Is it organization? Yeah.

Speaker:

Oh yeah. It was, uh, the Alliance for Suicide Prevention of Larimer County. Oh, sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, um, so I, I, yeah, I worked for them for a couple of years and, um, I, in, uh, I had the opportunity to identify where all the gaps in, in the, um, in the suicide prevention for Veterans apparatus exist. And, um. Uh, found orchestrated solutions and, you know, started this nonprofit around that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Gotcha. Interesting. Kind of a bunch of research on the front end and, uh, well, and like the, to the credit of Alliance for Suicide Prevention, they're talking about everybody, right? They're trying to serve every demographic and, you know, we had a few years ago a kind of a spate of teenager suicides in some of the schools around the region. And, you know, I'm sure at least to some extent, they were like, Hey, let's help make that not happen more, uh, as well. So Interesting. So it was kind of a, a, a weaving together of different learnings and based on kind of a passion pursuit for you. Yeah. Um. So, what's your team look like? Do you have kind of both? Uh, do you have employees, contractors, volunteers? All of the above.

Speaker:

Yeah. So we've got an amazing team. Um, so my, uh, Elena is my, uh, chief of operations. We've got Alexander, he's our, um, filmmaker, uh, documentarian. Okay. We've got, um, uh, Mitchell James, who's a really, really talented, um, rapper. Okay. In fact, he's got this multi-country European tour coming up. He's gonna be in all kinds of capital cities all over. Just coming up in the end of the month. I'm smiling

Speaker 2:

because I have a good friend named James Mitchell. Oh, okay. So he just, yeah, just switched it. Anyway, I mean, it was nothing funny that you said it was just me thinking about him. Yeah. So, well,

Speaker:

what does James Mitchell do?

Speaker 2:

Uh, you know, he's both, uh, a real estate guy, but also him and his wife. Do like couples marriage retreats kind of thing. Stuff. Super

Speaker:

cool. Where do they do that?

Speaker 2:

Uh, here, Northern Colorado.

Speaker:

Nice. Yeah. All right. I forget what he calls, but how long, how long have you known him?

Speaker 2:

Over, over 10 years. Wow.

Speaker:

That's pretty

Speaker 2:

cool. Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Anyway, continue with your team. I don't mean to derail this. Okay. Or is there more on your team?

Speaker:

Um, so yeah, I don't, I don't, I, I think I lost track of what we're talking about,

Speaker 2:

who we were talking about, who's, who contributes to the combat recovery.

Speaker:

Okay. Sounds good. So, uh, yeah, we've got a huge team, uh, a, you know, bunch of people that, uh, that help us achieve mission every day. Dabble

Speaker 2:

some, mostly couldn't do it without'em, volunteers as well. Mm-hmm. Tons of volunteers. Yeah. Okay. And what, uh, like, describe like a customer journey. You've got, you know, I know those three pillar pillars, but like if I am, oh, put me in, uh, you know, I was in Colorado Springs for a long time and definitely super high number of. Uh, post-retirement military down there in comparison, we have quite a few here with, uh, you know, Cheyenne here and stuff, and it's just a nice place to live, right. But in Colorado Springs, it was like every fourth house was a retired military, 40-year-old person kind of thing. Um, I mean that space, I, you know, I'm, I'm a realtor, part-time realtor, but I'm still struggling to really integrate well, been depressed, whatever I decide to engage with your program. What's that look like from there?

Speaker 3:

Okay.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Or, or is that how, how you engage typically? Is it just a person that kinda looks you up, finds.

Speaker:

I, I, from,

Speaker 2:

from a client perspective,

Speaker:

sorry, I'm, um, there was, there was a lot to take in there, so

Speaker 2:

I don't, if I'm that person that needs your services mm-hmm. As a, I've been feeling depressed, I'm a veteran. Okay. I knock on your door or I call you up and get an appointment. Like what's the, what's the interaction like?

Speaker:

Okay.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker:

So, uh, when, when someone contacts us, it really, it, it has a lot to do with where they are. Yeah. And so in, in some cases, you know, um,

Speaker 2:

in my case, I'm 40, I served, uh, 15 years. Okay. Did some combat. Uh, and now I'm having a hard time really integrating.

Speaker 3:

Okay. I'm impressed.

Speaker 2:

That was the story I set, I set up the stage, but I didn't make it clear.

Speaker 3:

Okay.

Speaker 2:

Alright. Sorry, I didn't mean to chase that trail into, uh, I'm just, I was remembering our days in Colorado Springs. How

Speaker:

was Colorado Springs?

Speaker 2:

Eh, you know, like seven adjacent communities to each other that didn't like each other that much.

Speaker:

What'd you do down there?

Speaker 2:

I was in banking.

Speaker:

Okay. How long have you been doing that?

Speaker 2:

Well, I did banking for 15 years total before I did whatever I do now. Is

Speaker:

that, that what led you to the think tank? Kind of, yeah. Okay. What, what was your, what was your purpose for starting this think tank? What were you trying to accomplish with it?

Speaker 2:

Um, you know, one for me, if I wanted a place where I could figure out how to become a business person Okay. After being a banker for a long time. Okay. Um, and then two, um, I noticed that. In, um, my banking career, a lot of people had kind of a peer advisory group, a peer community that would help them do the hard things that it takes to make a strong business. Okay. And, uh, whether they paid a bunch of money for it or not, that I noticed that similarity. And so I imitated that model, but made it more kind of community driven, if you will.

Speaker:

Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. So, uh, how long have you been doing this podcast?

Speaker 2:

Podcast is coming up on the end of the fifth season. So five years. Five years. Yeah. Five

Speaker:

years. And you've done hundreds of these episodes? Uh, like 240. That's a lot. So that's pretty cool. So what is, what is your goal? Where are you trying to take this? Where are you going with this?

Speaker 2:

Um, so Loco, think Tank Uhhuh, um, stands for local Community Think Tank. Okay. And so my, my theory is, is that there really should be loco think tanks in whatever Lincoln, Nebraska, and Cheyenne, Wyoming, and. Uh, Steamboat Springs, um, wherever there's kind of a give back minded business veteran that wants to be engaged in their community and help provide some structure and leadership to other people growing their businesses. Mm-hmm. And whether it's correct or not, I think the Loco Experience Podcast could be a digital leader in that space. I, I don't quite understand how quite to do it, but maybe I can attract facilitators in other marketplaces or, you know, even other, like, people that open regions can put some of the facilitators stories on my channel, you know, interview those awesome business veterans that want to add back to their community because it's really a, a volunteer ish, you know, I pay them, but not too much. They better have their, their finances in order what we call our local facilitators, which would be like a, the chair of the, of the meeting. Um, and I just love. Meeting people and hearing their stories, kind of, people have always shared their business journey with me as part of my banking career, and so I think it's an inspiring thing. I'd like to inspire more people to start something instead of just, you know, it's, it's easier in some ways to just go get a job at a big corporation, but, you know, that's not really a lifestyle that most people really want either. Okay. So if we could have more local, small businesses, I think the world will be a better place.

Speaker:

I hear you. So are you, are you celebrating any, uh, big successes recently? Have you had any, anybody you got any reach, any benchmarks or anything?

Speaker 2:

Mm. You turning this cables on me here? Yes. Becoming the interviewer? Yes. Um, you know, our, uh, our next level three chapter has, uh, three strong, uh, candidates that would bring us up to seven, which is, uh, we've been kind of bopping off the bottom in that chapter and that. Transition from, from four members to seven would be pretty momentum building.

Speaker:

Yeah. For it. Yeah. So what do you think, what do you, what do you think is, uh, your biggest challenges are in this space? Hmm.

Speaker 2:

Everybody's always selling everybody something All the time. All the time. That's tough. You know, and especially if you're the, the CEO of a, of a multimillion dollar business especially, or even just of a$1 million business, like everybody's trying to sell you something all the time.

Speaker:

So it sounds like there's a lot of, lot of, lot of noise, lot of noise, and it's hard to break through. Correct. What do you think your differentiators are?

Speaker 2:

Uh, you know, there isn't really an experience like loco there. There are other experiences. They're pure advisory, but that experience is, um. When crafted. Right. And, and curated in intentionally with the right kind of people is really powerful. And my discernment is probably one of one of the biggest differentiators in terms of finding facilitators that are cut from the right cloth and can deliver the goods well as well as fellow members that aren't annoying. Hmm. Um, so, and that comes from my 15 years of banking, you know, kind of trying to keep the, keep the upwardly mobile kind, uh, open people in the groups and, and keep out the, uh, dumpster fires a little bit and, and just people that won't really vibe or put'em in the right spot.

Speaker:

So what do you think is one, one thing that if, if you had, would just hit the gas on, on this whole project?

Speaker 2:

Hmm. On the loco think tank growing? Yeah, that's an interesting question. I don't think there is like a magic bullet. You know, I think loco grows one relationship at a time, one, um, community at a time, ultimately one member at a time. Um, and, and probably the best thing that we could do to enhance growth is to reduce, uh, uh, departure rate. You know, increase our, our, our, our rate of acceptance, but also add so much value to our members' lives that they can't even think about not continuing on.

Speaker:

What are your departing members, um, expressing?

Speaker 2:

Um, sorry, I haven't had somebody, uh, turn the tables on me so much. Um, what would be the biggest things? I mean, a lot of times they say no time. Uh, a lot of times it do. Do you think they're telling you the truth? No. I mean, everybody can make time for the things that they want, they really value. Right. So, so what they're telling you is they don't want it. Right. Right, right. And a lot, and, and the departing ones, if I'm honest, a lot of'em signed up for, but don't really want the authentic, uh, somebody telling me what they think about my, me and my business kind of experience that it requires. Um, that's some others, you know, I don't know. Um, I would have to, uh, go into it. But you're still, you're trying to deflect from, uh, my question. I am, are we tying it back?

Speaker:

I am. I am following the path that you led me down.

Speaker 2:

Okay. Um, do you remember where we jumped off? Oh, the customer journey. Journey, yes. So, um, I'm going to set the stage here. So I'm just gonna imagine a person that might connect with your organization, um, and paint that picture. I'm, whatever. I was a 12 year veteran, had some combat time. I'm out, I'm a real estate agent. I'm doing okay. I'm married, I got a couple kids, but I've been depressed. I've been struggling a little bit, have some trauma stuff, dreams, whatever. And I decide to, to give your. Your organization a call. Got it. That's me. Now, that's not me, but that's the, that's the imaginary person now who's,'cause I imagine every journey is a little bit different.

Speaker 5:

Hmm.

Speaker 2:

No. Yeah, yeah. Certainly. So set that stage for me. That's,

Speaker:

that's who I am. I'm Bob. All right. Well now I know why we had the conversation that we had, because that's what I would do. So we start by identifying goals, and then we identify obstacles, and then we identify, um, mechanisms to overcome those obstacles so the individual can achieve their goals and become the best possible version of themselves. Funny, I didn't actually lose you after all. It turns out, it turns out I was more on topic than I was aware of.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Um, okay. So, so it's really custom based on that person. And in that picture I painted, I've, you know, been having a hard time connecting, been depressed. Don't really have much going on outside of my job, which I don't really find nearly as compelling as my explosives ordinance officer job at when I was in the Army. Um, and like, what did

Speaker:

you like about your explosive ordinance job when you were in the army? It was exciting. Okay. Yeah. And, um, what else did you like about it?

Speaker 2:

You know, I developed a level of trust for my team that was really, um, incredible.

Speaker:

Okay. Anything else? Um,

Speaker 2:

you know, I knew people relied on me. Okay. What else? I feel like sometimes they don't anymore. I, you know, I think just the, uh, the, the adrenaline of it. I don't really get that anymore. Okay. In my life.

Speaker:

What else?

Speaker 2:

I don't know.

Speaker:

Okay. So it sounds like you told me that, um, you enjoyed having, um, purpose. And, and making an impact on the world. Uh, you told me that you, um, you miss being with your friends and you enjoyed the comradery, so you liked having a team. Yeah, for sure. So, um, so belonging, can we call that belonging? Yeah. Does that resonate with you? Yeah. Okay. And, um, oh, the adrenaline. So you like doing things that are dangerous. Turns out. Yeah. Okay. Well, um, what, uh, what, what can you do in your day to day where you will experience, um, purpose, belonging, and adventure?

Speaker 2:

Hmm. You know, as you know, I've been, you know, at the real estate office for a few years, but I don't really go to the office that much.'cause there isn't that much to do there. I should just be out, you know, finding clients or showing houses or whatever. But, um, so not a lot there. Mm-hmm. And, uh, so that's maybe, probably the first thing is. I haven't really found a new purpose, you know, between my military retirement and selling two or three houses a year, I have enough income. You know, my wife works, kids are mostly grown now. Okay. Kind off in their own. So what is my purpose?

Speaker:

All right. So we've definitely identified that that, that finding purposes is, is a priority for you. Experiencing belonging is a priority and doing adventurous stuff.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Okay. So I used to ride motorcycle when I was in high school, but once I crashed that first time, mom took the keys away and I didn't, haven't ridden since.

Speaker:

Okay. So, um, are you aware of any organizations that provide, uh, purpose, belonging and um, uh, adventurous activities to veterans? Um. Well, I thought maybe you guys, based on the website, we do. We do. Is that something you would like to be

Speaker 2:

involved in? Sounds

Speaker:

good. I kind of set you up as an ideal client there. Huh. So that would be kind of how one of those conversations can go

Speaker 2:

and probably like purpose, belonging, and community. Uh, and maybe adventure are like three. You're out of the top five for almost every man that was a veteran. Uh, yeah. In some respects. Yeah. Right. There's a, if someone joined the military, you

Speaker:

can probably guarantee that, that all those things resonate with them. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Um, so what's your imagination for where combat recovery goes, uh, you know, in, in terms of its journey? Are you, are you serving Northern Colorado clients only now and like. Is that the plan? You're, you're a community based organization?

Speaker:

So, um, we serve anyone anywhere. Okay. But, uh, we tend to bring people here Sure. So they can get involved in what we're doing here. And then ultimately my goal is I, we've, we've, we send, we send our young people off to war and then, um, they get hurt and then we, uh, we medicate them, hand'em a video game controller, uh, barely enough money to survive and, and, you know, say, just sequester yourself for the next 70 years and stay outta the way. Yeah. And really at the end of the day, that's a huge wasted resource. So what we are trying to identify here is that if you activate your veteran population on a problem that you have locally, they will solve that problem for you and be an asset to your community.

Speaker 2:

Is that really what a lot of veterans are doing Is. Just playing video games in the basement kind of thing. Yeah.

Speaker:

Really? Yeah. Just medicated out their gords. Wow. Yep. I mean, not, not all of them. Sure. By, by any stretch. But even if it's 10%, but a lot over 20 percent's, there's, there's a lot, there's a lot of dudes just wasting away Yeah. Not, not being utilized. Wow. Drinking themselves to death.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Or pilling themselves. So get, let's give them a mission and let's, let's utilize their desire to be impactful.

Speaker 2:

Hmm. Interesting. So, uh, to continue on, so you're. You're open to growth.

Speaker:

Uh, so the goal is to prove that concept so that other organizations, municipalities, local governments can, um, learn from us, subscribe to your program almost, and, and, and create their own solutions for their, for their veterans. Okay. So we will, we will go and we will help them set this up, um, whatever, whatever it looks like for them. But I, I don't, I'm not trying to prescribe solutions for people in Florida. Right, right. I'm, I'm prescribing solutions for people here. There's no help to protect in Florida. Exactly. And then you do some alligator hunting, and then if you, uh, want to like take what we've done and go apply it to your own. You know, problems, your own space, then let's use veterans to protect manatees or, uh, affect beach erosion. Yeah. Or, um, oh, uh, they have, they have, uh, invasive, uh, you know, pythons, pythons and, and lionfish in Florida. Right.

Speaker 2:

It feels like python hunting would be a very fun, it's kind of a no

Speaker:

brainer, I think. Yeah. So there's a lot of, um, problems that veterans can solve for people. So we are, we are creating the model by which other people can ask their veteran populations for help.

Speaker 2:

And how, how about your funding model, if I may?

Speaker:

Oh, yeah. That's a great question. Yeah. Thank you. So when I, um, worked at the Alliance part of, um, what I struggled with was, um, there were approximately 12 employees and one person prevented suicide.

Speaker 5:

Okay.

Speaker:

Uh, everybody else did, uh, wrote grants, did fundraisers, um, did all the backend grant compliance work, and most of them were afraid to talk to suicidal people. Mm. Um, I didn't think that that was really advantageous for the population that we were trying to serve. So, um, one big difference is we don't take government grants because they come with a ton of red tape and, and paperwork. Yeah. Yeah. And they'll straight up require you to hire people. So that's part of why you're a private grant rather than a We are a 5 0 1 C3, like any other 5 0 1 c. Okay. There's no difference there. Okay. Uh, it's just like I said, we don't, uh, we don't, we don't take the time. To pursue grants from the government. Yeah. And we don't take the time to be in compliance with the grants that Sure. You know, we don't want. Yeah. So that, that frees up a lot of, um, time and effort for people to focus on the mission. Okay. So, um, the way we, um, fund ourselves primarily is we create brand collaborations with other, uh, businesses. Okay. And so the, the business creates a product for us and um, and then we drive sales in their direction, and then they donate a portion of those sales to our organization. Is that right? So the idea is I'm not asking for money off your bottom line. Yeah. I'm asking to add to your top line and just take my fair share. And that's just business.

Speaker 2:

So if you might give, gimme an example of one of those kind of product elements, if you will.

Speaker:

Yeah. Happy to. So, um, one of our collaborations is with a local coffee, uh, roaster named Wander Coffee. Okay. And so they roast a, uh, a coffee flavor for us called Rising Phoenix Roast. Okay. And then when you purchase that coffee, when you buy it off the shelf and it's on store shelves, um, 10% of that, uh, goes to the non-profit. Okay. Yeah. Interesting. So we've got, uh, coffee, we've got chocolate, hot sauce, um, spices and rubs.

Speaker 2:

Oh. And then you can kind of put those on your website to drive like traffic to their product as well. Yeah. So, or on your website or within your social media channels, like you mentioned kind of driving business to them as well is getting. A money stream back.

Speaker:

So the, uh, the idea is that we do, uh, we do a brand collaboration video with them, put it out on the social media, and then we encourage, um, everyone in our network to, um, support that business. Yeah. And then I, I, I mention them whenever I can in podcasts on the radio, and if I'm on the news or whatever interviews I'm doing, I'll, I'll, I'll talk about our collaborations Interesting. And so that those businesses get, um, recognition. And so we have Wander Coffee, we've got Ranch and Rifle Spice. Okay. Um, we are working with, uh, nuanced Chocolate. Oh, sure. Um, yep. Brand new collaboration. I've got a meeting with them next week. Really excited about that. I love chocolate. Um, and then, uh, we've partnered with, uh, sweetheart Winery Oh. To create a completely, um, branded line of cis. Called Patriot Press.

Speaker 2:

Oh, wow.

Speaker:

And then, so, so if you, if you get that on tap or you, you know, get it in the store, um, again, 10% of the proceeds benefit the nonprofit. Interesting. Yeah. Is that

Speaker 2:

their whole line of ciders then?

Speaker:

Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's a complete cider line. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's themed toward the military. That's cool. And, um, and that's, that's a great collaboration. And then we also have, um, that's pretty smart branding too, because

Speaker 2:

cider, cider, but, you know, patriot press, that sounds pretty cool. And you press those apples to get that cider.

Speaker:

Pretty good branding. And then we also partner with Colorado Colorful Creations, which is our hot sauce. Uh, friends.

Speaker 2:

Oh yeah. Yeah. I actually, I think I. Connected with that person on LinkedIn recently or something. They do a bunch of different stuff. They've got a hot sauce company and this company and that company. Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah. He's got a handyman company. Yes. Um, yeah, Derek night camp, he's a very, very talented guy. He is always doing something. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Um, so I guess that continuing that funding model is, is kind of the, is that's your primary resource or do you get private foundation grants or do you have user fees? Do do your veterans No. Pay to play?

Speaker:

No, not at all. No, we, no, we don't charge, uh, our, our participants, everything we do is free to the user.

Speaker 2:

And can you get any like. Revenues for like fire prevention and maintenance and things like that from the state when you do those kind of stuff.

Speaker:

We are partnered with the watershed and we're helping them out with some stuff. Okay. And, um, yeah, there will be some, uh, funds coming away from that. Okay.

Speaker 2:

Okay. So it's like kind of, it's volunteering, but here's a little spiff for all the time and trouble A little bit. Kinda like

Speaker:

we,

Speaker 2:

um, so, okay. Um, and we don't need to know the specifics of it, but, but I mean, it seems clear that you're adding, if you bring a bunch of veterans out to do a bunch of post-fire remediation, like somebody should pay you a little bit or at least buy a lunch, you know, give you a image. Sure. You know, uh, you're adding a lot of value to the community is what I'm saying. Even if you're python hunting Right. In the Everglades. Yeah. So, so it's a pretty scalable funding model. Um, overall, if you can kind of find all those. Partnerships to, to be a part of it. Yeah. And I guess that helps to grow the awareness of the organization. How do people find you?

Speaker:

Well, uh, we are set up with over 200, um, veteran serving organizations, local governments, and um, businesses.

Speaker 4:

Okay.

Speaker:

Um, the Actis funnels for us. Yep. And, um, um, we're partnered with, uh, police departments, sheriff's departments, hospitals, EMS, all that. Um, the cos responder program, we work with them. Um, and then is that

Speaker 2:

how you meet'em sometimes is they're in crisis? Yes.

Speaker 4:

In some capacity.

Speaker:

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Whether it's alcohol crisis or mental health crisis or whatever. Yep. Um, okay, gotcha. And so sometimes either probably court referral too. Yeah.

Speaker:

As part of a, well, we, we actually work directly with the courts. Yeah. Um, we, uh, we're, we're part of the, uh, problem solving court here in Leer County, the Veterans Court. Okay. And so we advocated to get that started here. Interesting. And then, um, that took, um, like six years. Okay. And now it's finally up and running. And so, um, we, we, we go to court, we have a whole team of people that go in there, and we go into the, uh, the office hours before court with the judge and the prosecutor and the, um. Um, their probation officers and all, all the people that are involved in the, in the, in the justice piece, they're all in that room and they talk about each of the, um, individuals and, and, and what their plan is. And then we go into open court and we stand with them in front of the judge. And then, um, and then we, we help them to achieve their goals and to navigate that court process so that they have a more, uh, uh, yeah. The idea is to decrease the likelihood of recidivism, to decrease the likelihood that they keep bouncing off the system. And it's, it's very effective.

Speaker 2:

Well, you need to have a system navigator kind of, are you familiar with the Matthews House?

Speaker:

Yes, I am.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. I, I was on the board with them. And you've got a lot of similar themes that kind of evidence-based and, um, you know, having someone to walk alongside you for a season kind of themes. Mm-hmm. And maybe it's a, a longer season. Mm-hmm. Um, and even my wife does volunteering for casa. Mm-hmm. And having somebody that understands the system and can help. People navigate. Mm-hmm. You know, even if your intentions are good, sometimes that thing will suck you in. Yeah, absolutely. Um, I feel like it's probably a good time to zoom back all the way to Little Marshall. Okay. Like, uh, 5-year-old Marshall. What was your, what was your setting? Where were you at? Are you Colorado native?

Speaker:

So, I was born in Colorado, and I was raised in Oregon. Oregon? Yeah. Okay. Uh, rural Oregon. Urban Oregon, um, rural Oregon. Okay. Yeah. What part? Ashland. Ashland Not familiar. Yeah, it's on I five, just uh, just 10 minutes over the California border. Okay. Pa past the border into Oregon. Sure. Yeah,

Speaker 2:

sure. So that would be, I guess almost straight east of Portland, but quite a ways.

Speaker:

Yeah. So, um, Portland is, um, on the north end. Oh wait, yeah, that's north side. Okay. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

So there's nothing, so Bend is down there kind of closer or whatever.

Speaker:

So Bend is, um, in like central Eastern Oregon. Okay. And so Portland is in the north Yeah. Way

Speaker 2:

Northeast corner. Yep. And then nothing else in the south really too much.

Speaker:

So, uh, Portland is, uh, in the north on I five. Yeah. And then if you travel straight down I five to the southernmost point in the state. Yeah. That's where my town is. Yeah. Ashland.

Speaker 2:

And there isn't much as far as Urbana around that at all. It's kind of Northern Colorado, Southern Oregon, foresty stuff. Yeah. Fair enough. Okay. And what was the, the circumstances you got brothers, sisters, um, military family?

Speaker:

No, not, not a military family. And I was an only

Speaker 2:

child. Only child. Yeah. Okay. And, uh, what were you, uh, up to as a young man in rural Oregon as a hunting, fishing, bikes all over kind of thing?

Speaker:

Yeah, I, I did a lot of cycling, um, okay. Lot of, lot of bicycling, biked all over, um, camping, um, just spending as much time outside as possible.

Speaker 2:

Okay. Yep. And then, uh, when was the first inclination toward a, a, a military engagement? That September 11th. Interesting. Really? Okay. And how old were you then? 18. Oh, so that was right there. I turned, I turned 18, August 31st. Oh, wow. Interesting. Okay. And so you signed right up? Yes. Um, with Army Marine Corps. Force Marine Corps. Oh yeah. You said that before. Um, and, uh, what did that look like for you? Like, describe the scene. You're just outta high school, I guess.

Speaker:

Yeah, so I graduated high school in June. Yep. And then, um, August 31st I turned 18, and then September 11th, September 11th, and then I joined the Marine Corps, uh, just about a week or two after that. Sure. Um, and then I went to bootcamp, then I went to, um, they call it Marine Combat Training. And where's bootcamp for MCRD? San Diego. Okay. Yep. And then, um. After bootcamp? Uh, after, after combat training, I went to, uh, military police school to become an mp. Oh, interesting. Okay. And then after that I went to canine school to become a canine handler.

Speaker 2:

And how did, like, how did that come about? Were you, like, do they sort you, do they ask you which of these jobs you want, like, based on testing or assessments that they think, Hey, this guy should be a mp

Speaker:

So they, when you sign up for the military, um, they, at least when I did it, uh, they ask you to give your top three preferences for jobs. Okay. And so, um, I, I did that and I don't remember what my three choices were, but I know one of them was mp. Okay.'cause

Speaker 2:

that's where I ended up. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Gotcha. And, um, describe that, that seems like an interesting like role. Um,'cause you know, you know, in. Fort Collins are everywhere in Ashland. Uh, the, the police are a little bit like the other, right? Like there's, so it

Speaker:

was, I did it because I wanted to be a canine handler.

Speaker 2:

Oh, interesting. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, that was, what was that like though, being kind of, I don't wanna say the bad guys or whatever, but like, are you, is there any active, like, unless there's fighting and stuff, or what does it look like being a military police person, especially the canine handler? Like, what, what is there to investigate what is there to do? So, more than, I think perhaps

Speaker:

what we get involved in is, is called force protection. Okay. So we protect the war fighters. Oh, okay. Yeah. So like from the backside and stuff or like that? Or what do you mean? So if you have, like, let's say you have an infantry unit Sure. And they need to go on a combat patrol through Ramadi. Yep. Okay.'cause that's where I was stationed. Okay. So, um, they would, uh, uh, I, I would go with them. Okay. And walk in front of them to sweep for explosives.

Speaker 2:

Oh, I, so when I hear military police, I'm kind of under more of the understanding of like that enforced justice within the ranks almost of the military. But that's not really what we're talking about here. Well,

Speaker:

that, that's a component of military police. But even really, if you think about it, that that in itself is a force protection role. Sure. So, so really at the end of the day, military police serve as a, a, a one of the many components that ensure that our war fighters are safe, healthy. And ready to do what they need to do. Okay.

Speaker 2:

So in your case, this canine was not a drug sniffer, but more of a bomb sniffer. He was a bomb dog. Yep. And so you're running around, uh, seeing if, if, what's your dog's name? His, his name was Rex. So seeing if Rex smells anything suspicious and then like going into buildings, finding IEDs in some cases. Mm-hmm. Or hidden along the side of a road or whatever. Mm-hmm.

Speaker:

Exactly.

Speaker 2:

Dang. Yeah. Um, um, when was this, like how long after you signed up did you find yourself over there?

Speaker:

I was in Iraq for oh four and oh five.

Speaker 2:

Okay. So almost three years. Uh, two or three years after you first signed up? Mm-hmm. A couple years of training. Mm-hmm. And then, and then here I go.'cause that was about the, when, when did the Iraq one invasion kind of thing happen? Was it a year later? After 2011, I'm, I'm trying to remember my timeline. I was, I don't know. I was in bootcamp. Fair. It wouldn't have mattered. Uh, but they didn't go right to war. It took a little while, right before they kind of went, I think they invaded 2003. Yeah. Okay. That's what I was thinking. So you were there a year after, so it was pretty hot.

Speaker:

Yes. Yeah, very hot. Yeah. Historically it was the most violent time of the conflict.

Speaker 2:

Okay, gotcha. Um, and can you describe like a, like the scene, the like, um, the base I assume is outside of edi. EDI was. Was that where like a, a lot of the bad guys were at that time. They had kind of taken Baghdad, but EDI was the hotspot.

Speaker:

Okay, so Ramadi uh, Ramadi was pretty busy. Yeah. Um, we had, uh, several bases there. Um, we call'em forward operating bases. So Camp Blue Diamond was there, that, that was built out in Uday Hussein's Palace. And that was the headquarters for Marine Corps operations for the country. And then right across the Euphrates from that, um, was uh, hurricane Point. And then across the street from Hurricane Point was Camp Anaconda, I think. And then I know that there was another fob. Um, in another part of the city also. And those were like secure spots, but

Speaker 2:

within,

Speaker:

yeah, pretty secure. Uh, we would get mortared, um, on base, and then we would also, at, at 1.1 of our snip sniper teams got compromised. And I mean, by compromised, I mean killed. Yeah. And then, um, they, they, uh, uh, sniper rifles, oh, uh, radios and night vision. Oh. All got taken by the enemy. And then, so at that point, the enemy started sniping us on base at night. Oh. Yep. That's exciting.

Speaker 2:

I'm sure. Um, so your job is like you're going out on patrols, like block by block building by building, kind of clearing out the scene insurgency. Yeah. Yep. Wow. How long did that go on?

Speaker:

Uh, well, I was there, um, for just, just under a year. Okay. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

That was your combat tour? Yep. And then. I think I read on your profile that you were combat disabled. Is that right? Did you get blown up or? I

Speaker:

did. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Can you describe that? Sure, sure. Uh, we were traveling, um, southbound, uh, I think it was south, uh, yeah, I'm pretty sure, uh, between Ramadi and Fallujah. Okay. Yep. And, um, we're going over a bridge and, uh, an IED was detonated on the vehicle I was in, um, couple of Marines, myself and my dog were all injured. And then we were engaged with, uh, small arms fire, and I think, I think there may have been an RPG involved. I don't, uh, I don't know. Um, so yeah, and then we do what did you get?

Speaker 2:

Like rescued or whatever? No,

Speaker:

no,

Speaker 2:

no. We, you fought them off. We did what Marines do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Um. And then hightail it back to base, I guess, and patch you back up. No, we just

Speaker:

went back on mission.

Speaker 2:

Okay. Um, and was that the end of your military career or did you continue for a while? No, that was just the first time. No, that wasn't even the end of my deployment. Okay. Yeah. So, uh, what does that look like when it, when it comes time to be career ending, if you will?'cause you were did about how many four years of active? I did four years. Yeah. So, yeah. And then you, you came outta that into what kind of a, because this is what we're talking about a little bit, right? Like what your preparedness, how did, how did you get prepared to reenter society after that? Mayhem.

Speaker:

Yeah. Well, there's not a lot, uh, in place that prepares people for that. And that's kind of part of what, why you're here. We're trying to,

Speaker 2:

you're here. Yeah. Change here. So what was that like for you? Like, can you describe, yeah. Where did you land? Where had, you know, did, did you, were you married? Did you have a family?

Speaker:

No. Um, I, I went to, uh. Uh, Knoxville, Tennessee, and worked for the National Nuclear Security Administration as a canine handler for them for a little bit.

Speaker 2:

Okay. Yeah. Um, and how was that?

Speaker:

Pretty boring,

Speaker 2:

sounds like comparatively. Yeah. A little bit of lack of purpose. Yeah. Lack of community. Didn't know anybody. Exactly. Not much adventure. Yep. Um, what's, what's

Speaker:

next for you then? Uh, then I, uh, went and, uh, moved to Boulder and I worked in a bicycle shop and became a ski instructor. Interesting. Yeah. Kind of we're gonna depart this past chapter

Speaker 2:

and do something all

Speaker:

new. I wanted to do something more relaxing.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Yeah. Which it was. Yeah. Uh, I've had some community Yeah. Uh, had some purpose. Yeah. You know, comparatively, I suppose, you know, gotta fix this chain, straighten that wheel. That was actually, that was the problem, was the lack of purpose in the bike shop. That that's why I didn't stay there. Yeah, fair enough. Um. Then did you move into the kind of private security space from there or, yeah. Or not right away. Yeah. Um, and that was kind of a decently long career in that space before, before that tragedy in, in 19. Yes. Correct. Yeah, I did. Yeah. Um, are there other, so when did combat recovery start? You said 20 22 3 23. 23. Yep. And, and then you worked for that Alliance of Suicide Prevention. Is there things I'm missing in your chapter here that need to be understood to, understood kind of your drive in this mission? That's, that's pretty much the overview of how we got here. Yeah. Fair enough. Um, well, I feel like we should call a short break what I wanted to delve into just a little bit, um, because I'm sure. It was, uh, you know, it sparked this whole thing, but your business partner, um, his suicide in, in 2019, what was, if you might share, what was the circumstance? Was he married, family leave behind? Had he been struggling? Did you know, was it a surprise to

Speaker:

you? Gimme some of that. So I've known a lot of people to have killed themselves over the years, and his suicide bothered me more probably than most any. And I think, um, there was a couple of reasons for that. One is that, um, no one saw it coming. Yeah. It was a complete shock and I have no idea why he killed himself. And still, and I don't know if anybody does.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I haven't spoken to anybody that has been able to illuminate me on that. Hmm. Um, but then another piece was at his funeral, his stepdaughter, uh, wrote him a letter. And the, the person officiating the funeral. He, he read that letter aloud to the, you know, people in attendance. Yeah. Yeah. And it, it was, it was gut wrenching. Like she loved the snot out of him. She loved him and she talked about how his death impacted her. Yeah. And, and how she doesn't understand why, but he must have been in so much pain, you know, just Right. She forgave him even despite not understanding it at all. Gut wrenching how he could be there. Right. Yeah. So I knew that if by some stroke of magic, I could take that letter and give it to him before he made that choice, he wouldn't have. And there was something about that, that I felt like I was armed or blessed or Ibu with. A piece of knowledge, almost like a revelation. Yes. And that, that I had the opportunity to leverage that to impact others. So I'm not sure what the initial question was. Oh, you were asking more details around his Yeah. But it was a mystery it sounds like. But that, but that it was a mystery. But he left. But that's why it bothered me so much. Yeah. And, and that's, that's why, that's why his death inspired me to work in suicide prevention. Mm-hmm. And really, initially it was only my intent to do this for a couple of years, and then I was gonna go back to being an entrepreneur and just start another business. And, but I discovered very quickly that everything I love about entrepreneurship, I can do through suicide prevention without all the stuff that I don't like. So. It's, it's basically at the end of the day, I, I, I get to spend all day, every day having fascinating conversations and solving problems. Yeah. And those are my two favorite things to do. Hmm.

Speaker 2:

What was your security firm?

Speaker:

Um. Precision security. Oh, sure. Yeah. And then I had, uh, Grizz Biz was another one. Yeah. And, uh, Greene was So, precision

Speaker 2:

was pretty strong business at the time. Right?

Speaker:

Well, still, yeah. They're they're going very strong now. Yeah. They're, they're all over. Um, so a and I started that company together. Okay. Yeah. And a couple of other guys were involved. Um, and then, um. I had, I had the first licensed marijuana security company in Colorado. Oh, that seems smart. And that was called Green Safe. Yeah. Um, also there was a time when, um, uh, marijuana companies couldn't use the banking system. Right. And so, um, there was a bank up here in Fort Collins that would Yeah. The one down there off college. Yeah, exactly. Or off,

Speaker 2:

uh, uh, kind of boardwalk and harmony.

Speaker:

Exactly. Yeah. And so I used to, uh,

Speaker 2:

set up shell accounts or something.

Speaker:

No, no. Nothing illegal. I used to, um, I used to run their money for them. Mm. I would go all over Denver, collect hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars, and then run it up here to Fort Collins and deposit it for them.

Speaker 2:

Interesting.

Speaker:

Yep.

Speaker 2:

Um. Probably, probably nice little, you know, doing things that other people are scared to do is a decent way to make a buck sometimes.

Speaker:

Well, that's

Speaker 2:

what the security industry's about. Yeah. To a certain extent. Well, there's different levels, right? Like it's different providing security at a mic waka show with a bunch of stoned hippies than it is carrying a half a million dollars in your semi armored truck.

Speaker:

Yeah, fair enough. And spoiler alert, it was in my soft skin Subaru. Right,

Speaker 2:

fair, fair enough there too. Um, okay, well thanks for, for sharing on that. And so you have really had, what, when you started the security company, was it just a couple of dudes and a, and a and a truck or like, what was that entrepreneurial journey like, if you don't mind me asking?

Speaker:

Yeah, so I started by working for Pinkerton. Oh yeah, you've heard of them? I have. So for anyone who hasn't, um, I know. And so did is it will,

Speaker 2:

that runs precision now.

Speaker:

Will Wilford Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Yep.

Speaker:

I know Will a little bit. Yeah. Will's a great guy. Yeah. Yep. Gotcha. So, uh, Pinkerton, uh, has been around since, uh, the late 18 hundreds and, um, is basically, it's named after a man, and he was the father of modern detective work. Interesting. Um, in fact, the first detective bureau in the United States was the NYPD. Okay. And NYPD has a very, very distinctive badge. It's called a sun flare.

Speaker 4:

Okay.

Speaker:

And then, um, and then you have this, the, the state seal in the middle and then, and then a little rectangle on the bottom. Okay. So that is a, a, a dead copy of a Pinkerton badge. Interesting.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. A nod to, to the Pinkerton.

Speaker:

Yeah. Cool. So, because Pinkerton stood up NYPD Detective Bureau after he stood up Scotland Yard.

Speaker 5:

Huh.

Speaker 2:

Wild. Yeah. Okay. Um, and so that's where you learned your stripes, really learn the craft, if you will, the trade craft.

Speaker:

That's, uh, where, well, I'd say the Marine Corps, right? Yeah. Uh, taught me the craft, uh, Pinkerton is where I applied it. Yes, yes. Fair.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. That was the, uh, legal state side application of some of those skills, or at least, uh, understandings.

Speaker:

So that's how I got my start in the security industry, was providing services to them.

Speaker 2:

Gotcha. Yep. And then, uh, and when you, did you launch then, the precision security, was that a, were you a founder of that or part early partner?

Speaker:

Yeah, I was. I was, uh, one of, uh, four guys I think at the time that were involved. Yeah. Um. Then, uh, yeah, we stood that up. Really the story is, um, so I was, I was doing contracts with Pinkerton and then, um, I met this guy and he was running a bouncing company, so he was doing bar security, right. So I would have huge gaps in between my Pinkerton contracts. So I would go work bar security from him. Gotcha. And then if I had a contract where I needed more guys Right. I would use him and his best guys. Right, right. But what would end up happening is, is we would come together and I would work for him for like a month and he'd write me a check for like. A couple grand or something. Right. He'd worked for me for like one, one operation, well, one week. And I, I'd write him like one day, like one day, and I'd write him a check for several grand. So we, we really quickly found out, figured out that, that the, the money was in the higher end security. Right. And, and, and we needed to go after those contracts. And so that's when we started Precision Security was because we wanted a more reputable name Yeah. Than what he was using, which was Big Al's security. Oh

Speaker 2:

sure.

Speaker:

Right. Yeah. Yeah. And so, so we wanted something that could go after those bigger contracts. So thats how Precision.

Speaker 2:

Oh, that's cool. Uh, got named and became about, and former military guys and stuff like that. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Absolutely. I dig it. Yeah. Um. We have a fun game that I love, games our contestants play. It's not really a contest. What do I win? Um, fun. Unlimited fun. So you're gonna pick three of these ping pong balls outta here, and they're all each attached to questions. Totally randomized questions. Oh, this does sound like unlimited fun. All right, let's do it. Grab three. All right. 13. 13. What is a book, movie or podcast that's had a significant impact on you?

Speaker:

Oh, uh, rethinking Suicide. Hmm. Uh. Okay. By

Speaker 2:

some author. You can find it with the Google.

Speaker:

Yeah. Sorry guys. Sorry. Don't have it off the top of my head. Rethinking Suicide. Also a Tribe by Sebastian Younger.

Speaker 4:

Okay.

Speaker:

Um, those two books together are, are a lot of the ethos and backbone in Combat Recovery Foundation. Okay. And it's where evidence-based and effective comes from because both of those books are lay out in really, really evidential detail. Yeah. How the suicide prevention apparatus that currently exists does not work and is not built to work. Hmm. And that it is absolutely. Evidential that we need to adjust our approach. It's counterproductive almost. Exactly.

Speaker 2:

Well, is it as effective as the homelessness prevention stuff in California?

Speaker:

I would definitely compare the two

Speaker 2:

I I.

Speaker 3:

You,

Speaker 2:

I mean, it sets up a thing. You, you, that's the thing. A few hundred bureaucrats making$250,000 a year, it's gonna be hard to fix it. The pro

Speaker:

it's your, your spot on. The problem is you've created an industry around a problem. An industry always likes to grow. Yep,

Speaker 2:

yep. Um, yeah. Yep. It's a, it's a struggle of economics in some ways. Yep. Let's do number two. I like it. 19. 19. What's your go-to? Excuse when you want to get out of plans with someone if you have that? You are gonna tip your hand for future excuses. So

Speaker:

here's the thing. Alright, so this is gonna be a long answer. Okay? Okay. I'm ready. So the most effective, scary movies don't show the monster because you are way better at scaring yourself. Yeah, yeah. Than they are. So they just, they just put the information out there and let you make your own monster.

Speaker 2:

So you're like, something comes up or something's come up. So I, I gotta catch up to you later.

Speaker:

I just say no, and then I let them create the excuse for me.

Speaker 2:

Just no. Yeah. Not even, not even something's come up. Uh,

Speaker:

I am a, I'm a huge fan of single syllable answers. Okay. And, um, yeah, uh, brevity is the soul of wit. What's your last number? 61, 16 or, uh, sorry. 91? No, it's 16.

Speaker 2:

Eh, that one's boring.

Speaker:

All right. Pick, pick. Oh, wait. Quick question. Sure. What's your favorite question on that list? Hmm.

Speaker 2:

Um, you know, I don't know if I know for sure my favorite, but the one that I thought about just there was, um, what would you estimate your burp to fart ratio to be?

Speaker:

Yeah. I'm not gonna answer that. Okay.

Speaker 2:

Um, I'm gonna just find this one. Oh, this is a fun one. Yeah, this is, I, I like this question a lot actually. Uh, what's your death row meal? Like your, your last meal, you get anything you want with a great chef. Uh, as many courses as you desire. Um, but you're getting killed in two hours or three hours, depending on how long it takes you to finish. I get

Speaker:

as many horses as I want. Yeah. Alright, we'll strap in. I want the 86 courses. We're gonna, we're gonna do, we're gonna do a, a seared scallop over gra Mm. And then we're gonna move into, um, just one

Speaker 2:

because

Speaker:

we don't wanna waste space. Yes. The ammo bo. Right. And then, and then probably go to a steak tartar. Uh, I prefer that over carpaccio and then probably a, um. An arugula salad. Mm-hmm. Then I'm gonna go to, with a

Speaker 2:

little balsamic or something like that. Yeah. Probably some

Speaker:

vol, balsamic, little freeze just for the look. Right. And then I think like some, um, some, uh, roasted beets, but like, but like chopped, like brunoise, super small. Okay. Right. And sprinkled out over the top. And then, oh, probably, uh, candied pecans.

Speaker 5:

Ooh.

Speaker:

And then, um, we're gonna go into a, uh, a reverse seared, um, ribeye. Okay. Fingerling, potatoes, broccoli, and, uh, broccoli. Asparagus, chimichurri.

Speaker 3:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah. Does asparagus make you pee funny? It makes everyone pee funny.

Speaker 2:

No, but there's pee smell funny. No, it doesn't like 20, 20% of people, it does not make their pee smell funny.

Speaker:

Oh yeah. Fascinating. Yeah. Broccoli. Um,

Speaker 2:

and then is that why you don't like asparagus though? No, I just

Speaker:

like broccoli. Just, alright,

Speaker 2:

then

Speaker:

we'll move on. Um, oh, creme brulee. No, no. Not creme brulee. Uh, tiramisu. You could have both if you wanted. Probably gonna go with both And then, and then I guess I'll, I'll, I'll just have some cheesecake too,'cause why not?

Speaker 2:

Well, and maybe like a nice, um, nice bright coffee.

Speaker:

You know what they say, right? Yeah. You'd never wanna go to the electric chair in an empty stomach. No, no. Not on a full stomach

Speaker 2:

either. Probably. But

Speaker:

that's, that's someone else's problem.

Speaker 2:

So, um, preferred method of, um, execution if, if you had to choose.

Speaker:

Fucking fascinating answer or question. Yeah. Fascinating question. Okay. Preferred. Method of execution would be firing squad. Okay. Live by the gun. Die by the gun.

Speaker 2:

I kinda like that. Um, and like the cool thing about a firing squad is like, not everybody has a bullet, right? Like only three or four of'em. Yeah.

Speaker 3:

That's the cool thing. So

Speaker 2:

you could well, but if you're, that, if you're the executioner and you chop somebody's head off, like you damn well know you chopped their head off. Right. But if you're a 21 gun firing squad and only three people actually have live bullets, you're like,

Speaker 4:

eh,

Speaker 2:

you know, six outta seven chance. It wasn't me. Totally. You know? Yeah. So you don't have to feel bad. Yeah. Let, let's, let's

Speaker:

get that plausible deniability in there. Although

Speaker 2:

if you're the guy that shot him, you would know it. Okay. Right. Also, like you could tell when you're, the, yours is the bullet that hits the thing. I

Speaker:

just, I really feel like that should be a question on the application to become an executioner. Is, is, do you need. To have plausible deniability around the fact that you executed a person because Im, or do you find in it, maybe if you find joy in maybe different career field, maybe different career field,

Speaker 2:

but do you really want people to find joy in it

Speaker:

to be on your team? I, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm thinking maybe we just need to go somewhere in the middle, kind of the more emotional kind of people. Like, like, not like I'm enjoying it, but also not like it just doing my job. It's gonna destroy my world. Yeah. Maybe we find people who could just, I

Speaker 2:

Wow. Who have ethical, like, weird conversation. Yeah. Um, so you're wearing a wedding ring. You, you married guy?

Speaker:

Yes, I have found a woman to tolerate me. When,

Speaker 2:

when did you find her?

Speaker:

Uh, 2012. Okay. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

And she is tolerated you for all this time. Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah. She is a rock. She is absolutely an amazing woman. And, um, I, I, I couldn't do what I do without her being supportive of that. Hmm. Um, I walked away from a super, super lucrative career to do this. Yeah. And, um, this isn't

Speaker 2:

super, super lucrative. No,

Speaker:

not yet. Anyway.

Speaker 2:

It's, it, it, it, it can't be. Does she work too? I guess by, by definition it can't be. Yeah, she works. Um, so you're keeping the, keeping the lights on and stuff like that?

Speaker:

Yeah, no, I, I mean, I mean, we're, we're set up to be, to function. You're live and lean. But the point is that, that I, I walked away from a lot of money to do this, and she is in support of that. Yeah. And that is really nice. Yeah, for

Speaker 2:

sure. Um, I had a similar experience, you know, I was a$80,000,$85,000 plus bonus banker, you know, 12 years ago. And, uh, you know, that's still a little higher than my salary today. Um, and gosh, I'm having a lot more fun. That's the idea. Um, and does this person have a name? Yeah. Corey. Hey Corey. Hi Corey. And, uh, what's your favorite thing about

Speaker:

her? Her, um, mellowness and, uh, she doesn't blame shift. Um, she, she accepts responsibility. Yeah. For what she does. She can, you can have a conversation with her about a thing that might not be completely comfortable without her freaking out, losing her mind, thinking that she's under attack, deflecting, bringing all this like trauma drama to the table. Yeah. We, we can just be like, Hey, that bothered me. And she could be like, oh, okay. What bothered you about it? And I'd be like this, I'd be like, oh, well I'll make this adjustment. I'd be like, thanks. Okay. How can I adjust? And so it's, it's a really collaborative relationship. It feels like we're on one team.

Speaker 5:

Yeah.

Speaker:

And, and, and I've been in a lot of relationships where that's not the case. We, uh,

Speaker 2:

my wife and I call ourselves Team bear. Yeah. You know, just to cement that notion that we are on the same team. I love that. I love that team. Spring doesn't have quite the same. Ring to it, but it's pretty cool. Yeah, it works. It's dream springing. It's um, yeah, it could be dream springing team. Dream spring. Totally. We'll go with that. Spring dream. Yep. Um, do you, uh, know why she has stuck around with you since 2012? Do you have theories or does she tell you Sometimes

Speaker:

I think that she's a glutton for punishment, discomfort, likes adventure and mystery. Yeah. Yeah. She, she just, she just

Speaker 2:

hates it when, like, two days are the same. So as we speak right now, um, we're gonna flash into the current events segment as we speak. We're in like day 12 or 14 of the US government shutdown. Um, I dunno if you noticed, I, I mean, does it affect you? No. It doesn't affect your retirement pay or anything like that? Or do you get pay after four years in military or you don't get Nothing really. It, it doesn't affect

Speaker:

me

Speaker 2:

$187 a month or something like that. Like the,

Speaker:

the government shutdown doesn't affect me.

Speaker 2:

Well, it, that's the thing. It doesn't really seem to affect most people unless it really affects you.

Speaker:

Yeah, I don't, right. I don't, I I, I am perfectly happy with the government being a shutdown as much as possible for as long as possible. The go, the government's purpose is to create problems and not solve them. And so as long as they're not operational, they're not causing problems. Fair. Okay.

Speaker 2:

Alright. We're gonna get along just fine. Um, talk to me about, uh, like war. Okay. Um, Trump was apparently narrowly edged out by, uh, a lady we never heard about from Venezuela for the Nobel Peace Prize recently. You think that was, uh, uh, appropriate? I don't, didn't, didn't know. Notice it, have any information on that. He was lobbying. You can't really lobby for it and get it. That's also a truth too. No. Um, but what do you think about like, right now, the hot news, right? A week. A week, not even a week old is the Israel. Palestine ceasefire thing. Mm-hmm. Any, any reflections on that? Should the US military be involved in peacekeeping in the future over there?'cause it doesn't seem like either of those guys can keep their heads on straight, uh, when left together. Yeah. I'll ask you anything. This is a hard show.

Speaker:

We've got a very powerful military. We have the first and second largest armies. We have the first, second, and third largest air forces. We have the first, second, and third largest navys.

Speaker 2:

Would you say first, second, and third, like we've got multiple army divisions. That would all be the biggest ones, or remember? No.

Speaker:

So the largest navy in the world is owned by the army. The largest air force in the world is owned by the Navy. Gotcha. The, uh, largest, uh, the second largest navy in the world is the United States Navy. The third largest navy in the world is the United States Marine Corps.

Speaker 5:

Hmm.

Speaker:

The second largest Air force in the world is the US Air Force. The third largest Air force in the world is the U US Marine Corps or the US Army. And the fourth is US Marine Corps. The first largest army is the Army, and the second largest army is the Marine Corps. The, the, in terms of people or in terms of like Yeah. People, weapons and stuff. Especially so, so let me, lemme break this up. The Army has more boats than the US Navy. Wow. The US Navy has more boats than the US Marine Corps, and the US Marine Corps has more boats than any other military in the world. Oh shit. The, and I, I could be, I could be a little bit off on this, but I'm pretty sure the Army has more aircraft than the Air Force.

Speaker 2:

Really?

Speaker:

Aircraft has a second amount. Most aircraft Oh. Because they've got, got

Speaker 2:

so many helicopters,

Speaker:

especially, and, and the Navy has the third amount, most aircraft and the Marine Corps has the fourth amount most aircraft Wow. In the world. And then after that, we look at foreign nations and their. Military sizes fair. Right? So we, we have more people in, we have the same number of people in the, in the US Army than, uh, lemme back up. We have more people in the US military than there are in Australia.

Speaker 2:

So should we like so downsize our military. So the point, do we need that much excess capacity?

Speaker:

The point that I'm making is that the, the US military possesses massive unmatched capacity to achieve mission. Okay. What missions we achieve and how we go about achieving it, and whether or not we should Yeah. Is the question totally. But the bottom line is if there is an unsolvable problem on this planet, the US military is the most equipped group to address that.

Speaker 4:

Okay.

Speaker 2:

Alright. Um, so that, that problem seems the most unsolvable, like the Russia, Ukraine thing seems a little more solvable with conventional means in some ways because the, I don't know, maybe not.'cause the Ukrainians are pretty crazy. Uh, they were, everybody's crazy. Right? Except for me and you and I'm not so sure about you. What's the question? There isn't a question. It was a joke. Okay. You like that one though, kind of, right? Um, what would you like to ask me?

Speaker:

What do you want this podcast to turn into?

Speaker 2:

Hmm. You know, um, a, uh, a, a cash. Machine would be perfect. Um, so you wanna

Speaker:

monetize,

Speaker 2:

eh, no, I mean, yeah. Yeah. It'd be nice

Speaker:

to monetize it. What's your shortest path to monetization? I, I don't want to do this again.

Speaker 2:

Oh. Um, alright. I won't ask you a question, sir. Yeah, I, that it just doesn't seem like the right format for it. Um, you,

Speaker:

you did ask me to ask you questions.

Speaker 2:

The short, the shortest path to monetization would be, I suppose, sponsorships and, and more listenerships. Um, but it also might include like, not doing a long form because then you get a lot more listenerships and have a lot more higher chance. And I don't wanna not do a long form, so, you know, I kinda wanna do what I wanna do. Uh, so that's also true. But Joe Rogan did it, so Dammit. I can do it.

Speaker 3:

Okay.

Speaker 2:

Um, what I think I wanna do is move on to our closing segment. Okay. The Loco experience. Okay. It's the craziest experience that you're willing to describe to our listeners. Um, might be a moment. You already talked about getting blown up a little bit and continuing on with your day. Um, but in this journey or past chapters, uh, when I say, what's that craziest experience of your lifetime that you're willing to share? What, what did you think about?

Speaker:

Well, it would be, it would take a while for me to quantify that. So I will tell you about my most recent crazy experience. Okay. Um, yesterday I, uh, got back from Australia. Okay. Um, and, uh, I was down there to, uh, create an international coalition of veteran suicide prevention organizations that can come together annually in, uh, what we're gonna call, what they call. And, you know, now that we're building the group, uh, the Veterans Games and, uh, so it's, oh, it's a lot of obstacle courses and stuff. Kind of like adventure races or something. Exactly. Except that you go through it, uh, in a team of eight. Okay. And you do, um, uh, you know, challenges and obstacles and, and, and have to work as a team to get through the evolution together. That's cool. And so, uh, yeah, so we're creating, um, an international coalition of, of, of people to focus on. The idea is that our governments bring us together in dark corners of the world to kill people. Well, what happens when we come together and, um, you know, focus on in sunny spots? Yeah, yeah. In, uh, yeah. On the Gold Coast of Australia and focus on building community purpose, belonging, eliminating isolation, and serving our communities. Yeah,

Speaker 2:

I'm excited about that. Me too. And, uh, I wish you very much. Well, I think that sounds extraordinary. Like, I don't know quite how to ask this question, but it, it feels like you're, your perception of. War and our government's use of force and stuff has shifted over time. Like how would you have them use it? I mean, you mentioned it's the strongest, most powerful military, but should it be used, should it be shrunk? Do we need to have that to keep China from being the bad guys of the world and whatever? I know it's a very reflective question, but you've had,

Speaker:

we over utilize our military and we do not. Um, when we utilize it, we do not give our war fighters a clear, uh, defined, uh, mission. Hmm. Uh, a goal set, uh, or an end state. Mm-hmm. And so that the result of that is, is protracted decades long engagements.

Speaker 2:

Some of the Afghanistan thing is. The most obvious example, right?

Speaker:

Yep. So, so here, do you know when the last time the United States declared war was,

Speaker 2:

um, was it World War II or Korea? Yes. World War ii. Yeah. Yeah. So, which is

Speaker:

pathetic. Everything since then hasn't been a war. Yeah. Um, which is dumb and you're not, you're not supposed to be able to deploy the military right. Outside of a declaration of war. But we've seemed to figure out how to do that. Right. But this is what I think is really interesting. A lot of people like to point the finger at politicians. Here's the deal. Uh, state of Virginia just had a ballot initiative where, um, you can't deploy the Virginia National Guard. Without a DEC Declaration of War.

Speaker 5:

Mm.

Speaker:

You can send Army, Navy, Marine Corps, air Force, and every other National Guard in the state. You just can't send the Virginia National Guard without a formal declaration of war just to draw a line in the sand somewhere. Yeah. That, that's great. Bill did not pass. Oh, the people voted that down. Interesting. So here's the, and it was probably

Speaker 2:

used in part to be like,

Speaker:

so here's the takeaway from that. Here's the takeaway from that. Yeah. There is no shortage on the part of the American population of, of, of their willingness, their hunger, their desire to send our young people into combat. So we have got to get better about rehabilitating them when they come home. Hmm Hmm.

Speaker 2:

cause you think that that war fighting is just gonna in you,

Speaker:

well, evidently,

Speaker 2:

right. Um. Yeah, it's an interesting, you're, you're a hundred percent right. Like, if we're gonna keep doing that, at least we gotta do this.

Speaker:

Yep. Um, I, I, I tell people all the time, the very best thing you can do for combat veterans is stop making us.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker:

But that is not happening. I mean,

Speaker 2:

is that part of your mission almost? Is to advocate for that? Yeah, absolutely. Okay. I wondered, it feels like it's within your conversation, if not within your, uh, mission statement. So Marshall, it's been fun. Cheers. I'm thankful. Thanks

Speaker:

for having

Speaker 2:

me.

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Curt Bear

Host